Extended interview: Rusty Johnson, Libertarian candidate for U.S. House District 7

WFYI is speaking with U.S. House of Representatives candidates running for election in Central Indiana.

Libertarian Rusty Johnson is running for election in Indiana’s 7th Congressional District, which represents most of Indianapolis. He faces incumbent Democrat André Carson and Republican John Schmitz. 

Johnson is a disabled veteran who wants to see VA reforms and an effort to reduce the national debt. He ran as a Republican two years ago for the same office.

Reporter Benjamin Thorp sat down with Johnson to discuss why he wants to run for office.

This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity and style. WFYI fact-checks all candidate interviews and provides editor’s notes in the audio and digital publications.

Ben Thorp: Why are you running for election in this district?

Rusty Johnson: Well, I ran two years ago, and I got beat in the primary as a GOP candidate. One of our candidates that was running for a different office, called me and said: ‘Hey, it's okay to make fun of disabled veterans. It's just politics.’ And I got furious. I contacted the County GOP chairman and the state GOP chairman* and said, ‘Hey, are you going to stand up for our veterans or what?’ Never heard back from any of them. I got mad. I went out and we told everybody, don't vote for this guy. This is what he said about our veterans.

And December of last year, I switched parties to libertarian, and because nobody was standing up for our veterans, and really nobody in the seventh district, the GOP turned their backs on the seventh district, and I said, That's ridiculous. Our people are suffering and everything and [Democratic incumbent] André  Carson's not doing anything for anybody. So I decided to run as a libertarian.

*Editor’s note: WFYI reached out to the GOP Chairman for a response and have not heard back.

Thorp: What do you think are the most pressing issues heading into the 2024 election?

Johnson: Me, personally, I believe that social security and our national debt are two very important things that aren't being addressed by either party. The [federal government] borrowed all this money from Social Security. What they pay back each year is 7% in interest. That comes out to $19 billion in interest each year that they pay back. And both parties are saying Social Security is insolvent.* Social Security's insolvent. It's not insolvent. We got $19 billion coming in every year, plus everybody that's working is still paying into it. It's not insolvent. They just keep taking and taking and taking from Social Security. I have five ways to pay back Social Security and pay down the national debt at the same time, within four years, nobody's talking about it.

Nobody has a clue on how to pay back Social Security and pay down the national debt. And the big personal one that I do is our veterans and Social Security. I want to revamp both of them. Like the VA will give a veteran their 100% disability this week. In two weeks, they'll drop it down to 80%, 60%, or even nothing.** They'll give it and then they take it away, and the veteran has to do without. And our veterans are suffering and dying waiting on the VA. It's a horrible agency. Like I said, it took me 19 years to get mine. I have seven Vietnam veterans who have been fighting the VA for 54 years for their disability. It's horrendous, and we want to make changes to it.

*Editor’s note: The government does borrow money from Social Security in the form of Treasury bonds and pays back on those with interest. It’s not clear where Johnson is getting the figures of 7% interest and $19 billion, however. When asked to clarify, Johnson said he found the numbers on Yahoo.com.

**Editor’s note: WFYI reached out to the VA and requested a comment on this but hasn’t received a response by the time of publication. WFYI also reached out to a lawyer with the Illinois-based Vet Law Office. That lawyer said, while it’s possible that VA mistakes had led to a reduction in benefits, there is normally a process where veterans will receive notice that their benefits will be reduced and are given an opportunity to overturn that decision within 60 days.

Thorp: Indiana faces questions about the future of its healthy Indiana plan, now that a federal judge has struck down things like premiums as violating federal law, how would you like to see the state proceed when it comes to its Medicaid expansion program?

Johnson: The Medicaid program, as you said, it's more of a state issue, but I think that I think the state just really needs to reevaluate how they're treating people with disabilities and stuff as well. Some states are charging or taxing Social Security recipients for their Social Security benefits, and I disagree with that. You know, we paid in and we paid in and we paid in, and now we're disabled.

We're entitled to that for our disability, or because of our age or whatever. It's not an entitlement, but we paid into it. So, when we become disabled, we depend on that for help. As a disabled veteran, waiting on the VA for 19 years, I lost a home, I lost my first marriage, I lost everything. Fortunately, I was never homeless. But it's ridiculous that we have to fight and suffer and die at the hands of a government agency that is so rogue, that the Secretary of the VA announced four weeks ago that he's $15 billion in the hole. He said, If he doesn't receive $3 billion by the end of September, starting Oct. 1, disabled veterans would not receive disability checks. So, I believe that that's the way the state might be going with Medicare. All of a sudden it's not going to be there. You know, even though we didn't do anything the government did.

So, I think the government really needs to be overhauled to begin with. We need to get people in there with good ideas on how to revamp all of these programs to make it more accessible, more user-friendly and easier to get your disability or whatever you're applying for, such as Medicaid, Social Security, veterans, disability.

Thorp: Indianapolis is hoping to make use of some $140 million from the federal government for a new public transit bus line. That line came under scrutiny during the most recent legislative session, with lawmakers hoping to pause construction in a way that transit officials say would have essentially killed the project. Do you have any perspective on how the city should be managing public transportation projects?

Johnson: I'm not big on the bus ideas, or plans that they have. I think there are better uses that they need to use the money for than for buses. I mean, you go down Washington Street, there's two to three lanes. You're going to take away one or two of those lanes, and it's going to be even more congested than it already is. And it's not really going to help anybody. I guess they're trying to force more people to ride transit and stuff. And I'm not big into that.

I think we ought to just repair our roads first, and our streets, they're horrendous. No, I'm not big into the bus lines. I'm okay with the transit, you know, where the buses are and everything. But as for redoing the roads so it's dedicated just for buses - no, I'm not for that.

Thorp: Homelessness has been increasing in this district much as it has across the country. How can cities better invest federal resources in managing housing and homelessness issues?

Johnson: Well, one thing that we found out years ago was that the VA is putting homeless veterans into apartments. But we found out, my wife and I found out, seven months ago that these apartments are empty.* They have to sleep on the floor, they have to eat on the floor and everything. So for the past seven months, my wife and I have been going around the state, picking up, I mean, furniture, household goods, clothing, and toys for their kids. And we do this for free as part of our not-for-profit that we're doing [at] the Rusty Old Ranch.

The government, probably the best idea for them is to prevent homelessness to begin with. One thing I believe that was really screwed up from when Reagan was in office is when they shut down all the mental health facilities.** I believe we really need to invest money into opening some of those back up, or building new ones, and getting our mental health patients back into [a] controlled environment so they're not stuck out in the streets. They're not becoming victims of people who want to take their money, take their medication, or take their lives.

*Editor’s note: Some apartments are furnished. Some are not. Several Veteran Not for Profits have contacted me asking me to help them in getting furniture. Try with HVAF. They also assist Veterans with clothing and so forth.

**Editor’s note: The movement away from state-run psychiatric institutions is more complicated. In 1963, John F. Kennedy signed the Community Mental Health Act, which was aimed at creating community mental health centers, but that never received adequate funding.

After that, President Jimmy Carter passed the Mental Health Systems Act in 1980 in an effort to provide better funding for community mental health centers, but much of that bill was repealed in 1981 under Ronald Reagan.

A lot of them don't have - what do you call it? They don't know how to take care of themselves. They don't know how to give themselves their medication. A lot of times they sell their medication for drugs or just because somebody has money and they need to eat. We need to get that back under control. We need to get them off our streets and get them taken care of with their mental health care. We're starting a ranch called the Rusty Old Ranch. We're going to be doing mental health care for veterans, first responders, and handicapped children, and then we're going to be housing up to 40 homeless veterans. We're doing shipping containers, turning them into apartments.

We're going to bring them in, clean them up, get them the mental health care they need. Once they're cleared for mental health, we're going to hire them to work on a ranch for 120 days after that, we're going to take them anywhere in the state they want to go and help them get a job after 30 days, we're going to buy them a house they can't sell, lease, rent or mortgage the home for five years. That protects them from any of their creditors trying to take it away. It also protects us in case they want to sell drugs or alcohol.

So yeah, but by hiring them to work for 120 days for us at the ranch, we're going to train them how to farm, how to take care of animals, horses, cattle, chickens, rabbits, hogs, and then we're also going to have Equestrian Therapy, aquatic therapy, music therapy, art therapy, archery therapy, karate therapy, its therapy, fishing therapy and woodworking and so we're going to train them how to do some of this stuff. We're going to train them how to grow flower gardens and flower beds. We're going to teach them how to grow vegetable gardens.

And then all this, the VA will pay them a per diem as well as them earning money from us, and they get to save that money. Everything on a ranch will be free for them. And each one of them will receive a puppy from America's vet dogs at eight weeks old. And we're going to train them how to train the puppies.

So not only are they going to get a puppy that's going to give them unconditional love, but they're going to have to start trusting our trainers to teach them how to train the puppies. So they're trusting people again. And that's one of the big issues with being homeless, is that they don't trust people. So that's another tool in the toolbox when we turn them back loose in their communities.

Thorp: Give us your perspective on how Indiana is positioned in the global market right now, particularly when it comes to China, we've invested heavily in semiconductor manufacturing. What are your thoughts on this?

Johnson: Well, I think first of all, we need to invest back into the United States and pay off our national debt and pay back Social Security and get this taken care of. I think that we have enough talent in the United States. We don't really need to be going to all these different countries to bring in their people. What I think we need to do is invest in Americans, especially right here in Indiana, we have so many great colleges and so many intelligent people.

We need to invest in them and their ideas, thoughts and plans like this ranch. I came up with this ranch two weeks after I lost my primary, and I've been focusing on this ranch. I'm not a politician. I hate politics, but I'm sick and tired of our veterans and our disabled people being taken advantage of by our politicians, and they're playing games with our disability and everything else. So, I help veterans get their disability, and also help them get Social Security.

I think that we need to invest in Americans. And we have a lot of disabled people that have great ideas, but nobody wants to listen to them because they have a disability. They are this, they are that, or whatever, but nobody wants to sit down and listen to them. We have a lot of homeless people that have great ideas, but nobody wants to listen to them and invest in those ideas to help them. Help make America like Trump says, I guess, make America great again, or make America even better than what we ever have been. We've got so much division, hatred, and anger going on here that nobody cares about each other anymore, and we got to bring that back.

I tell everybody the difference between the other candidates and myself, and that's not just our race, but a lot of them is the difference between them and us. Do we care about the people? We need to unite the people, not the parties. The parties have failed us for a long time. They're standing there waiting for their next handout with their hands white, stretched out as far as they can go, and we got to say, ‘No more’. Our offices cannot be for sale. We've got to use any and all money to invest back into America, pay down our national debt, pay back Social Security, and then invest in Americans.

Thorp: Last question, can you tell us about who you're backing for Indiana governor and U.S. president in the upcoming election?

Johnson: I'm supporting Donald Rainwater –– 100%. Donald Rainwater helped me when I transitioned from the GOP over to the Libertarian Party. He is an awesome man, and a great friend. Donald actually sends a lot of veterans over for me to help take care of him with their VA disability.

For President, I've met the libertarian candidates. I like them. I say, I really would have to go with Donald Trump. Donald Trump helped me get over 450 veterans their disability when he was in office. And nobody's really talking about the veterans right now. The Democratic Party, like I said, they've got $15 billion in debt at the VA, and that's never happened before.

And then the other thing about that is, why did the Secretary of the VA wait till he's $15 billion in debt to even ask for help, you know? And that's the other thing. We've got to be on top of this, you know? We’ve got to hold these people more responsible than what they are - accountable. And nobody's doing it, and so we're fed up with both parties, and we're saying if you are to vote the bums out, get us in there. We know how to clean it up, and we will clean it up.

Thorp: Thank you for taking the time.

Johnson: Thank you.